Episode Transcript
When I was a kid, I wasn't a fan of chores. With every item on the to do list, I was usually dragging my feet—which ironically, typically made for more work. And each time my feet dragged, usually by way of complaint, refusal, or bargaining, I received a similar response from my mom. She would say, "Jon, I'd like for you to do as I say the first time, but there's really only one thing I want to hear you say, and that's, 'Okay, Mom.' That's it."
Now, on paper it looks like a pretty simple request, but in reality, it's anything but. Because once "Okay, Mom," is spoken, it puts into motion something that can't be undone. If you can't put toothpaste back into a tube, un-ring a bell, or put a genie back into a lamp, then you certainly can't unsay "Okay, Mom."
It's a small sentence with big ramifications—namely, time—because that sentence is an hourglass. And once turned, there's only so much time to complete the task before the stakes are raised, usually with some variation of my dad getting involved. A movement toward an inevitable end.
And that's what I always liked about the biblical account of the wedding at Cana. There was always a certain amount of relatability between me and Jesus with regards to our respective mothers.
When the wine ran out, Jesus wasn't an "Okay, Mom," kind of guy either. And by my family's standards growing up, he appeared to be quite the opposite.
Good mothers tell their children to be like Jesus, but not one of them mean this particular mother son exchange, certainly not mine. Because if I would have said, "Woman, what does this vacuuming have to do with me?" Well, let's just say I would have soon had the opportunity to discuss the finer points of this biblical text with my maker directly. No, he may have not immediately complied with his mother's request, but unlike any excuse I gave, his reasoning was better.
Jesus wasn't just dragging his sandals. We know this because he invoked time in his response. "My hour has not yet come," he replies, as if knowing "Okay, Mom," would raise the stakes and put into motion something that couldn't be undone, a movement towards an inevitable end.
And yet he did comply. And unlike my often half-hearted small efforts, he complied big.
Really big.
Like, hold my wine and watch this big. Because he not only met the needs of the wedding party by way of his first public miracle, but he did so while simultaneously revealing his ultimate plan of redemption and foreshadowing how he'd do it, probably making up for the toaster that he brought.
Let me explain by starting with the venue.
Throughout scripture you get the idea that God enjoys marriage and a good wedding party.
From Genesis to Revelation, there looks to be a close and intimate connection between the Creator of the universe and his love for marriage. So perhaps it is not much of a surprise, then, that he chose a wedding to perform his first miracle, as if drawing our attention to something greater than the supernatural equivalent of a late-night beer run.
Which brings us to the miracle itself, turning water into wine. Lots of it. Jesus didn't just make a little bit of wine, he made gallons—according to the passage, upwards of 180 gallons of the stuff—or as my great-grandpa would call it, a tasting.
It's almost like once he decided to say, okay, Mom, he decided to make a statement, a statement so big that it would take three years to be fully understood.
At the wedding feast, the significance of wine was introduced. At the Last Supper, it was revealed. Fitting, since it looks as though the wedding at Cana and the Last Supper were bookends to Jesus' ministry.
What started as a symbol of his glory ended as a symbol of his blood. In both cases, his actions were singularly focused to save a bride in desperate need. But the symbolism doesn't stop there. See, Jesus could have easily refilled the original wine containers. They were obviously empty at this point. But he didn't. Instead, he instructed the servants to fill with water the containers used for Jewish rites of purification, an important element of Levitical law handed down by God through Moses to cleanse the Jewish people both physically and, more importantly, spiritually.
Many times throughout Jesus' ministry, he made it known that he is the fulfillment of the law, and that it is through him, not by ritual or ceremony, that one is truly and ultimately purified from sin.
Hebrews 10:19-22 summarizes it well. It reads,
"Therefore, brothers, since we have confidence to enter the holy places by the blood of Jesus, by the new and living way that he opened for us through the curtain, that is, through his flesh, and since we have a great priest over the house of God, let us draw near with a true heart in full assurance of faith, with our hearts sprinkled clean from an evil conscience and our bodies washed with pure water."
Jesus is signaling once again that he is the one who the Old Testament proclaimed, the one who would be the final sacrifice for the purification and removal of sins, purification no longer by water, but by his blood.
And how was this new wine received?
The master of the wedding exclaimed, “'Everyone serves the good wine first, and when people have drunk freely, then the poor wine. But you have kept the good wine until now.'”
As if being the first to testify that there is soon coming a better way, a new wine that will make the old traditions taste like the cheap stuff.
Years ago, my mom was to the point: do as I say. The instruction was simple and yet how often did I resist?
At the wedding at Cana, Jesus' mom was also to the point: do as he says. The instruction is simple and yet how often do we resist? Mary's words remain as relevant today as they were over 2,000 years ago.
So let us be reminded that we can listen and comply with confidence.
We can do because of what he did. And like Jesus, let's do big. Because the good stuff is no longer being withheld. It's already been poured out for you and for me.
Welcome to another episode of The Defined Podcast w/ Dr. Jon et al., a Bible study in which panelists from a variety of backgrounds, including coaching, education, management, ministry, and psychology seek hope and truth in what some would call austere times.
Indeed.
My name is Chris, your host, joined again with of course, Dr. Jon and once again Robyn Nelson, Rogelio Navarro and Mandy Michaels. Welcome everybody.
Thank you.
Oh, thanks. My pleasure.
Today we are looking at the word "do" and a call to action as found in the book of John, chapter 2. Our scripture of the day is verses 1-11 and reading out of the ESV.
"On the third day there was a wedding at Cana in Galilee, and the mother of Jesus was there. Jesus also was invited to the wedding with his disciples. When the wine ran out, the mother of Jesus said to him, 'They have no wine.' And Jesus said to her, 'Woman, what does this have to do with me? My hour has not yet come.' His mother said to the servants, 'Do whatever he tells you.'
Now there were six stone water jars there for the Jewish rites of purification, each holding twenty or thirty gallons. Jesus said to the servants, 'Fill the jars with water.' And they filled them up to the brim. And he said to them, 'Now draw some out and take it to the master of the feast.' So they took it. When the master of the feast tasted the water now become wine, and did not know where it came from (though the servants who had drawn the water knew), the master of the feast called the bridegroom and said to him, 'Everyone serves the good wine first, and when people have drunk freely, then the poor wine. But you have kept the good wine until now.' This, the first of his signs, Jesus did at Cana in Galilee, and manifested his glory. And his disciples believed in him."
All right, Dr. Jon, your opening vlog blog about doing, opening comments around the table.
Yeah, well, so with this, with this one, I was kind of thinking back to the discussion we had on "follow." And it's kind of cool because these two kind of, in my opinion, kind of go side by side or one after another.
What do we do after we follow?
Right? Then we do. And so, I love how Mary told the servants at the wedding, like, just do what he tells you to do. And I think that we're definitely called to do as well. And so, my question was kind of, like, in my mind, like, well, what do we do? Like, what is God calling us to do? And I think.
I think it's in particularly. I think it's in the book of Matthew where the Pharisees ask God, what's the greatest commandments? And I feel like that's.
I don't know if they're saying it facetiously or like, to, you know, sarcastically, but then God's like, well, I'll tell you. It's love the Lord of God with all your heart, mind and soul. And the second one is love your neighbor as yourself. So, then I'm thinking, okay, so those are two "do" things that God, that Jesus said.
And so, then I'm thinking to myself, so then, what does it mean to love the Lord your God? What does it mean to love the Lord your God with all your heart, soul and mind? And I looked up a commentary by Matthew Henry, and I'll just read that really quick. A portion of it on that particular portion of scripture says,
Our love of God must be sincere love, and not in word and tongue only as theirs is, who say they love him, but their hearts are not with him. It must be a strong love. We must love him in the most intense degree, as we must praise him, so we must love him with all that is within us. It must be a singular and superlative love. We must love him more than anything else. This way, the stream of our affections must entirely run. The heart must be united to love God in opposition to a divided heart. All our love is too little to bestow upon him, and therefore, all the powers of the soul must be engaged for him and carried out towards him.
And so, I just think I love that depiction and that kind of commentary on what it means to love the Lord your God with all your heart, mind and soul.
And it almost sounds like the way that Matthew Henry said. It's almost like a wedding vow, almost. And I think that it's, to me, it all kind of came together. Like, all this takes place at a wedding party. And so, I think to do is to love the Lord your God with all your heart, soul, and mind. And then the other side of it is to love your neighbor as yourself. So basically, it boils down to love.
Yeah. Well said. You know what? When you said to do things out of love, I love how you said that, because I think love is an action word. And so, to do things like, like love isn't, isn't a feeling. Right? And so, I was just thinking, I mean, it can be. Maybe it's accompanied by, by good feelings, but love is also. It's like, it's like a commitment, a decision to do things because we love is also a decision.
Yeah.
And I was just thinking of, like, well, like, I mean, obviously Jesus, to do what he did on the cross as well. Like, he chose to do that. I mean, he, because of who he is, but he still chose to do that. And so, I just think of, like, it's like an action to do.
There you go. Love is a verb. DC Talk.
Yeah.
I was thinking that of the scripture that says faith without works is dead. And I think that if you were to take what you're saying about loving people, how do you do that in reality? What does that really look like in that scripture of faith without works is dead? It's so easy, I think, to go to church and tick that off, the box off, and say, I've done my due diligence for the week. It's so much harder to take that into your everyday life, to take it to those people who aren't your friends, people who would treat you badly, people who cut you off on the road, people who you work with who aren't your, you know, who are coming at you, whatever that looks like in your individual life, you know, those people that just kind of butt heads with and having that love for them despite that and praying the blessing over them instead of wanting to curse them. And, you know, when you're at the check stand building a relationship with the people that you seeing consistently and loving on them, doing by loving people in your everyday life and taking that scripture and the word of God and being the hands and feet of Jesus in a very realistic way.
That was actually where my first thought was when you talked about doing the word "do."
Matthew Henry summarized it in his commentary. But the scripture that came to mind for me was 1 John 3:18. It says, little children,
Oh, I did write it down. "Little children, let us not love in word or talk but in deed and in truth." And that is, again, like, where my brain also jumped to was Jesus giving us this commission to love the Lord our God with all our heart, soul, mind and strength, and then to love our neighbor as ourself. And that love is an action word. It is even like, and the Bible is so cool because it defines love for us, which I hope one day we get to dive into that, too. But it gives us a very clear-cut definition of what love is. And pretty much everything that it says, like, none of that is feelings. Just like Rogelio was saying. And I think that good feelings can come from those good choices and good decisions we make in love. But when you look at the definition of love according to the Bible, I mean, theoretically, we can love people we really don't even like, because we are deciding to do so based not on our feeling, but on the command that God gave us. And usually, as a result, good feelings follow.
We can love people even if we have a dislike.
Right. Yeah.
We're supposed to. I think that's the thing, is not like God "shoulds" on us. But that is why the command of love comes in, is because oftentimes we don't feel like. And same with, like, faith without works is dead. The hope, we employ that faith or that decision to love when we feel least like doing so. Right? Like, it's. It's not.
God wouldn't have to command us to love one another if we felt like doing it.
If it was easy.
Right?
Doesn't really come natural all the time.
I think a great example right now in the world so divided between the wars going on is to say, I'm not in one side or the other. I'm for people, in general. I'm just blanket for people. I love people. I want people to win. I don't want this side or that side to win. I want people to win. I want Jesus to win. I want Jesus to be able to touch the hearts and minds of these people and bring actual change to the climate and to the scene.
That's probably where Jesus is, like, you're going to face persecution. Like, there's going to be people you love that don't love you back. And even to, like, an extreme extent. And so, like, covers that bit too, where we love even people that don't love us back. So, it's like, it doesn't matter how we're treated.
Right.
We're called to love regardless of the response. And so, I mean, that's why it's, like, patient. Like, that's a big, like, love is patient. Love is kind. Well, because we need to enact those things for sure.
And turning the other cheek it's so hard in real time. It's so hard. It has such a lasting effectual change on the streets. You know, with Reach Ministry, we see it all the time where people, when you first meet them, they're just angry and they're hurt and they're defensive and they'll come at you pretty hard. But you show up consistently and you just don't take that on and you just keep loving them where they're at. And you see the change over time and you see people being willing to step out of that and off the streets and into a life. It is so powerful. Love is just, it really does change everything.
You know, as I've seen, you help a lot of people on the streets, Mandy, I kind of appreciate the sort of like the hands, heart and the head analogy where you're out using your hands to help people, to serve people first as an act of love and then like with the heart, just kind of building that relationship and then kind of maybe talking about specifically, maybe about gospel readings and things like that. Because I think we can often flip that around where it's like if people don't think like me or agree with my beliefs and my faith, then I'm not even going to have any relationship with them and let alone serve them. Like, I'm not even going to think about serving them. And so, the idea that love starts with helping and using your hands to do so, I like that concept.
Yeah. It's pretty amazing how many miracles have to do with something tangible, something physical, food, wine, something that meets a need in the person.
And of course, this example here in John, chapter 2, it's making water into wine. There's other miracles where the fish and the loaves of bread were multiplied.
In the Old Testament, manna came from heaven to feed the people.
But the last part of the portion that I read there, "And his disciples believed in him." Belief is the outcome of the miracle. And a ministry like Reach Ministry who's actually going out and also providing, I think, physical sandwiches or food or lunches or breakfasts or something like that to people, that really is a gateway to belief once those needs are met. So, it's an interesting connection there between provision and belief. There's a link there.
There was actually a pastor in India we met who has the gift of healing, and he would take anybody with anything that you can imagine, elephantitis and leprosy, whatever, and he would lay hands on them and he'd pray for them and see the healing instantaneously. And of course, it would draw a massive crowd, and then he would get up and preach the gospel. And he was talking to us about this and talking about how the gift was to draw the crowd. The gift wasn't to heal their infirmities in this life, but eternally. Right? To bring people together to be able to share the gospel and share the power of God, not him and what he's doing, but what God is doing through him. Very powerful.
Yeah. It's like what the people need in that moment. And I guess in a more general sense, when, like, a missionary goes to a third world country and they're just preaching, but they're not feeding, like, physical food, people are like, hey, it's great that you want to talk about God, but I'm dying of hunger over here. Like, can you help me out there? And so, yeah, what the people need is the gateway then to be able to talk about their eternal need.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Which goes with people in our sphere of influence and the people we see consistently, because everyone has stuff in life and everyone has a need for a relationship and just have that person that keeps coming by and loves them where they're at and shows them care and remembers their name and what they were doing last week or their kid's graduation. It's very potent.
Yeah. Yeah, to be a, to say I'm a Jesus follower and then not do anything practical?
Right.
Okay. You be a Jesus lover and, like, not, like, care. That's not going to be a great testimony. Like, it's not even. It won't even land with people.
Right.
No.
Yeah.
And you would really be surprised how many people would love for you to pray for them. Complete strangers.
Right.
Absolutely. Please pray.
Yeah.
Whenever I get an inquiry, more often than not for counseling, whether it works out or not, at the end of the conversation, I'll typically just be like, can I pray for you? And I'd say about 90%, if not higher, say yes, even if I'm not going to see them again.
I've prayed for everybody you can imagine out there. Fascinating.
You know, conversely, I feel like when I try to do too much, like, without trusting more in Jesus, it's also easy for me to not allow enough room for God to do what he's going to do in my life. And I think I'm the first person to mess this up because I think I try to do things and I have good intentions, but then I just kind of, like, rely on myself and even subconsciously and so just allowing, even stepping back, because sometimes it's like, well, where was the space for God to actually move in that place in your life? Or were you just, like, just revving it up to, like, you know, 180 miles an hour on your own? Not literally. Hopefully.
You're looking at me, it's a challenge.
I know you drive fast, Miss Leadfoot.
Only in the Aston.
All right, well, um, I know we've got another segment coming up here.
Um, anybody know any jokes?
Yeah.
I don't think I want to tell anymore jokes.
You want to hear a pizza joke?
You joked out?
You want to hear a pizza joke? Never mind it's too cheesy.
Oh.
The last time I tried to tell a joke, it didn't go over too well.
That was one of my favorite moments of my life, actually. That was so good.
That's great.
So, you're just. You're done with jokes?
I'm done with jokes.
Well, you're a doctor, so, like, do you want to hear a HIPAA joke? Do you want to hear a HIPAA joke?
I do.
Sorry, I can't tell you. It's confidential.
That's great.
All right, well, we're going to continue this discussion next episode, but for this episode, any closing thoughts?
Yeah, so, like I said earlier, there's the two commandments that Jesus basically whittles everything down to love the Lord your God and love your neighbor as yourself. And so, Robyn, I think you kind of alluded to it earlier. What does it mean to love? There's some specifics to that. And so, when we're talking about how do we love those around us? 1 Corinthians 13:4-8,
Love is patient. Love is kind; "love does not envy or boast; it is not arrogant or rude. It does not insist on its own way; it is not irritable or resentful; it does not rejoice at wrongdoing, but rejoices with the truth. Love bears all things, believes all things, hopes all things, endures all things. Love never ends."
So, if we're trying to figure out how best to do this life, that's a good blueprint on how to do this life. 1 Corinthians 13:4-8. Memorize that, understand it, and if you're having an issue with any one of those, then that's a great space to shore up how best to live this life according to what Jesus would have us do.
That's good. I would add, I kind of really like what you had to say, Rogelio, about doing what God would have for us and being open to what God wants to do in our lives. And I just. I think that's such a powerful statement, because God wants to do a lot as well in us and through us and being available for that is, I mean, that's like a huge topic in and of itself. But I love that you brought that up because I think it's so important for people to have that perspective of being willing and available to allow God to work in their lives and move in their lives and to work through them in those places and things like 1 Corinthians 13, you know, this is where you can come to God and say, like, I'm really having a problem with arrogance or whatever, that is pride.
Pride. And I have a lot of pride, and that's something God works with me on. So, allowing God to do the work in me so that I can be the hands and feet of Jesus, that's good.
Chris, last time you said something about doing the one step that's in front of you that God's put in front of you. And I think that I'm trying to remind myself to kind of, as you were saying, to kind of let go of my outcome and, like, give it to God and things might not end up as I expect. Right? Like letting go and let God to be cliche. Just. I think I'm working on that.
Excellent.
I think that what the Lord has been showing me in this season for when we love people, we're talking about right now, this conversation has kind of been about loving people in a general sense, like a bigger group of people or people, strangers and things like that. But God is really showing me love, like, in relationships as far as, like, how much, like, how costly that can be and how painful that can sometimes be to love people who are not good at loving you back or don't have the skills for that. And I think that it's really, it's really teaching me also what God sacrificed for us that we talked about that, like, some, you know, some people are just going to reject you or whatnot. But God experienced that with us. And I'm really, just really impressed upon how I think we all have this intention of loving people well. And I think just like anything else in our lives, we think that we can do things by, like, our will. Like, we're like, I will save all my money and I'll buy my acreage and I just, like, sheer power of will or I will get through school and I'll become a doctor or whatnot. And then there are certain things when it comes down to it that we don't always realize what's going to press up against us when we're trying to do that. And so, when I'm really trying to love people well, I didn't take into account that this person who in my mind is, like, so great, they also have their own baggage, and now they're coming up against me with anger that I didn't see before or. And I'm just, I'm just really, like, really struck with the nuances in these relationships and things that are God impressing upon me to, like, stick it through. We like, there's so much value and so much return in loving people well, and it really makes us more like the Lord, and we experience God in ways that we haven't before. So, this was a do podcast, not a love podcast.
But to do is to love.
To do is to love. And to love really is to do. So.
Do love.
Do love. Can that be my t-shirt?
Do love. That's my next hat.
That might make it onto a hat.
Yes.
Do love.
Anyways, I think that kind of sums it up, but that's what the Lord's showing me right now.
Okay, alright, great.
All right, well, thank you once again for joining us with another episode here of The Defined Podcast w/ Dr. Jon, et al. We look forward to another episode very soon.
Take care, everybody.
Bye-bye.
Bye.
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